(LifeSiteNews) — On this week’s episode of Faith and Reason, John Henry-Westen, Father Charles Murr, and Frank Wright discuss the schism trial of Archbishop Viganò, the rumored ban on the Traditional Latin Mass (TLM), former President Trump criticizing Biden for “persecuting” traditional Catholics, a warning about an imminent Third World War, and more.

The Vatican charged Archbishop Carlo Maria Viganò with schism last week, summoning him to an “extrajudicial penal trial” on June 20 over a “denial of the legitimacy of Pope Francis, rupture of communion with Him, and rejection of the Second Vatican Council.” Viganò did not appear on that date but responded to the charges online, saying he regards the accusations as “an honor.” A few weeks before the schism charge, Viganò accused Francis of committing the same abuses as laicized ex-cardinal Theodore McCarrick.

Fr. Murr called Archbishop Viganò an “honorable, honest man, a man of conviction, and a man of deep faith,” and said he was safe from the charges on most grounds. “If, for example, you say that the Second Vatican Council is not a dogmatic council, then there’s nothing that binds him to it dogmatically.”He also said Viganò is, in fact, faithful to the magisterium.

“To be part of the magisterium does not give you the authority to create new things. What it does is it puts you in contact with tradition and with Jesus Christ above all. This does not give the magisterium the right to invent new teachings.”

Murr further cited some of Pope Francis’s actions during his pontificate, such as the Pachamama incident and the direction he’s taken the Church, saying Archbishop Viganò is correctly pointing this out.

“The only thing I would not have said was his last remark against the Holy Father, against his moral integrity. You don’t say those things; you could say it to the right persons and get it investigated, but you don’t say those things publicly.” Fr. Murr clarified that this shouldn’t be swept under the rug, but Viganò should have approached Pope Francis with the accusation before going public.

Wright said Viganò is simply mentioning a reality that is forbidden to be mentioned. “The crisis in the Church did not begin with Pope Francis and has obvious roots itself, which is also scandalous to mention because what it results in is an inexorable process in which we depart from… the tradition of the Catholic faith into what is effectively a new religion,” he said. Wright further stated that it isn’t surprising that someone as faithful as Viganò would come into conflict with that system just as other clergy have.

Wright disagreed with Fr. Murr on Viganò’s statement that accused the Holy Father of abuses and defended the archbishop. “If a situation is dire and one of abuse within a family, then it is only by publicizing that abuse so that they can be corrected. A culture of silence simply enables it.”

Westen said we need proof, reminding viewers that LifeSiteNews did contact Viganò immediately for more information, but he said he could not provide that at the time. “I do know that the archbishop, when questioned on things before, has had detailed evidence, but we’ll see.”

The panel later discussed the reported ban on the TLM next month. In the past week, Vatican journalist Diane Montagna has confirmed that this document has been presented to Pope Francis by Vatican Secretary of State Cardinal Pietro Parolin and would ban all celebrations of the TLM except for “approved Ex-Ecclesia Dei institutes,” such as the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter (FSSP) – meaning all diocesan Latin Masses would be banned. The Vatican has recently blocked the ordination of priests who offer the TLM and denied permission for Archbishop Monsignor Peter A. Comensoli to continue celebrating the TLM in his cathedral.

Fr. Murr underscored that Rome would not be victorious in eliminating the Latin Mass. “This frustrates them even more. They hate [the TLM]; it’s like a crucifix or holy water to the devil; it’s unbelievable. Just ask yourself, ‘Why anyone would be upset with the Mass that we have had as Catholics for 1,700 years?’”

Wright emphasized that we should refer to the TLM as “the Mass” and not accept “the 1960s replacement,” saying that “if you judge it by its effects, you can see that it’s becoming less and less Catholic.” He also reminds listeners that this problem began in the 20th century, which he calls “the century of the self,” when the arts, literature, and philosophy began turning towards the self as the center of the world. So, he said, it’s appropriate that in the middle of the century, we saw the Catholic Church “turning away from God and towards the people. From ad orientem to ad populum.”

For more discussion on Viganò, TLM restrictions, and more, tune in to this week’s episode of Faith & Reason.

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