In his new song “People, People, People,” East Tennessee singer-songwriter Zach Russell reflects on the grind of trying to make it in the music industry: “I’m almost as old as Jesus was when he started up a band/I’ve been at it for 15 years, and I still don’t have 12 fans.” 

Like the song, the line is signature Russell, steeped in whimsical reflection and tinged with religious imagery. Lyrically, “People, People, People” fits the mood of his 2023 album, “Where the Flowers Meet the Dew,” but with a funk and groove that feels like an artist expanding his horizons.

Late last year, I visited with Russell about the album, which has been in heavy rotation on my playlist ever since. We recently caught up to discuss the new song and his writing process. Our exchange has been edited for space and clarity.

Craig Nash:

In our conversation last year, we discussed your religious and spiritual journey, from your childhood as a Southern Baptist to explorations of Eastern beliefs. While you still have feet wandering over the religious map, you talked about how you came to peace with your Christian upbringing and the established set of stories and iconographies it handed to you. You said, “It ultimately comes down to the fact that, when you are telling a story, you can only tell your own story.”

With that as a backdrop, can you talk about the genesis (no pun intended) of the opening lines from the new song? “If I ever get back to the Garden of Eden/ I’ll sink my teeth into a stone/ Ya know it won’t be an apple that I’m eating/ Won’t know what’s right and what is wrong/ I’ll be in a field beyond good and evil/ Where it’s way too big to talk about.”

Zach Russell:

Yeah, that last line is from a Rumi poem. I think the direct quote is, “Out beyond the ideas of right and wrong, there’s a field, and I will meet you there/ When the soul lies down in that grass/ the world is too full to talk about.”

I’ve been finding myself really taken by the Taoist point of view lately. I may have been sort of fiddling with it back in the day, but it’s really starting to work its way into my life and my decisions. First off, there are similarities to Christianity. It says the true Tao cannot be spoken of. Lao Tsu in the Tao Te Ching speaks in these poems about looking to nature, letting things happen as they need to happen, letting the natural thing happen, and being still so you can tell what the natural thing is. This is reflected in several newer songs I’m writing right now. 

CN:

This seems to be a theme in how I engage in your work and then talk with you about it: There’s a line I think is fun and light-hearted, and then you drop the information that it’s from a Rumi poem!

As a writer, I’m always trying to make connections, and this may seem forced, but a lot of your work, though very different in style and substance, makes me think of Tom T. Hall. When you first listen to one of his songs, it’s easy to think, “Oh, that’s a cute turn of phrase.” Then, you give it a second listen and realize how deep the well he drew from was.

ZR:

Tom T. Hall was always a writer that inspired me. As songwriters, we are asked to be authors. But instead of 300 pages, we get maybe 48 lines. So I’m always thinking when I write a line, “Does it explode in your head?”

And then I go over it with a filter again, which is like sonically and phonetically tuning it in, almost like trying to be as “Dr. Seuss” as I can be, putting as many little internal rhymes and treats in there. Hopefully, when it comes out on the other side, not only do you have something good to listen to, but something that can grow on you as well and make you realize, like, “Oh, these aren’t just lines.”

I also like to think about Bible stories, where the author is just passing the story on. When you really start looking at it, there are different ways to view all the scriptures, and people can study them forever, you know? So I like the stories to be bigger than the words.

CN:

The Dr. Suess reference is brilliant and one I hadn’t considered. But now that I hear you say it, and as I reflect on the new song and “Born Again” from the last album, it makes sense in how you use repetition so cleverly.

ZR:

In writing, I look for what it was like the first time I heard the Johnny Cash song “All I Do Is Drive.” And at the end, he just keeps repeating the word “drive,” and it’s not just that he’s saying the same word over and over again. It’s that he’s picked a word where the repetition is its own joke. It shouldn’t make sense, but it does.

I’m getting to this point in my writing where I’m not concerned with being high-brow or people thinking I’m smart or anything. Sometimes, it gets to the point of a song, and it’s almost like an artist– I’m just going to stand back and just throw some paint on it, just because I’m bored and my arm wants to do it.

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“People, People, People” is available on streaming services today. Next month, Zach Russell will play shows in Greenville, South Carolina, and Knoxville, Tennessee. More information can be found at zachrussellmusic.com.